38 min read
Good morning. Afternoon after night after night caries Warning to Australians given a few minutes to join in and you might notice me sharing a shift for the first time in about five or six weeks and actually, even those who have been watching a lot. You can see when he can actually looks maybe a little bit of a had enough next year. So packed off the long hair last week and just got too too much for me. Sustain it isn't the longest in like 20 years. I've never had a cat like six weeks already seven weeks. So it's a very long time. So if you're looking forward to getting he got will give you. We'll give you in just a minute or so to get in. Now we'll start is going to be the full hour. And as we as we get into it as well. So we're going to run a poll a bit later on. What so I'm going to start webinars and they're going to give us a fortnight. So you want to go 8 o'clock in the morning or 4 o'clock in the afternoon or midday whatever works. Or it's just an awesome on demand will be interesting to see what time works works for you guys. So we'll give it a minute. No no that's holding steady. So I think we'll begin. All right. So is always for those who are new. And don't know me. I am damn plod founder of frugal software. But also a trainee for 2021 years more in 25 years. And had 20 plus staff and tried the business. Side note I know what I'm doing. Housekeeping you'll want to be muted to avoid background noise. If you have questions taught them in the queue and I and I will answer them. At the end, we will spend time answering all your questions when I want to pay lots of sales questions. So I'll answer as I go. And don't be afraid to ask lots of questions. And I don't mind staying over time going through all of them. You cannot vote the ones that ask the same question. So come to the top. Once again, the slides and any notes will be shared with you. So never worry about trying to get the notes right. We'll start right writing my introduction right. So let's talk about selling. So for those of you who've attended a recession cycle. I think this will be quite good. It's quite helpful. I'd like you to know that I had to learn to sell and undertook lots of sales coaching for me in my teens to learn how to sell. So I was our first major figure software. Or nine years ago, we had zero customers and had to sell it. And so I had to lean cold calling. And then I had to do it had to go out and sell it and go to people's homes and call on trades and do often. So I used to hate it. I absolutely was the anti salesperson. But when you just have to learn to sell to make money, then I'd hate to get overall and learnt it all. And now I actually absolutely love selling. I think it's phenomenal. And once again, I just was like, OK, you will be assigned to it just got to learn Linda prices. And selling is really wonderful. I truly enjoyed. Also, if you've watched my other webinars you'll be familiar with my concept of first principles or a cascading narrative. And that is it is a formula or by principles that are always in operation with everything you do the job always at hand is to learn what those are in the situation you're dealing with. Apply the correct principles and then build your foundations up from that. So that's what we'll start off on the other big thing with sales is I love the setting is I can explain it to you. But I can't understand it for you. So with selling. It's one of those things you just really have to do to truly understand it and see it and feel it in real life. It's you know it's like reading and making on to draw the car. It's only by driving the car. You didn't get a drug selling with selling you actually just have to do it to get over it. But you must do according to principles. So there's a better cover not to edible. We'll take probably out. I do when I answer all your questions have been so pleased you all stay. And we'll see if we can't maybe a newt or maybe open the video at least at the end to see if we can maybe do a joint session is it really helpful to get that bit direct feedback on selling or want to cover off bullets. In this webinar a general sell series. So the general theory underpinning and selling to win quotes selling to get your business and end up selling the sales technique isn't so much trying to deal with like a maintenance job. This is more of tournaments to work with more value. So big jobs with money in it right. So I'm not dealing with someone who's just got a broken tap or I can help one just once. Well, as costing fixed tomorrow. In those valleys it's not what this is about. So all the talk is because really, if you think about it. I think I want low margin low volume work right. This might be better written by mean. To do it. But that's not how you sort of make money in your business. Gross so therefore having moved up the value chain. OK So let's start with the sales theory that underpins all of the cells dynamic that we're dealing with in order for us to make the higher value sales. OK So what the first concept is people move away from paying they do not move to pleasure. So this is very, very, very, very important to understand when selling. So what it's like, OK. So as I say, I'm pinching you with this hand right. I'm pinching and pinching a wrist really hard with this hand. But in this game. I've got a really nice. Your favorite sweet treat. This is your favorite trade on. I'm pinching you really hard. This hand are going to move towards the trade and you're going to move away from the pain you're going to be away from the pain. Right So the fundamental thing is people move away from train. They do not move towards pleasure right. So you must you must understand that when you're selling. So principle 1 principle 2 you must also show that by doing nothing is worse than doing something right. So you want to keep those tooth those two points and tension to make them aware of the pain. Because often people are not aware of the pain. And so this list is loose is a real example. So let's say someone's caught up. And I want you to replace the kitchen. That's dripping now the chances are that kitchen tap has been dripping for a very long time. Most kitchen tips drip for months and months and months and months and months before someone finally takes action. The see. Let's break it for months and months and months and months. So why have I finally called you. What has just been triggered on the pain journey that I finally decided to take action. So your job is to find out what why have they finally decide to call you now like a best path is different or a blind switch was different. We're not talking about that here. What we're trying to do is trying to relate to you hottest selling this trying to uncover why did that person finally take action now. Because that's the pain point you're trying to uncover because when you're selling that's the bet you have to solve is why did they why did you finally called me now. That's the aha moment right. So this guy is the scenario someone could judge to replace the kitchen. And you know I find out you find out what's happening is the tenant who's been in the property for two years is finally moving out new tenants meeting in the new tenants have requested. They want the tent moved and ball volatile on life moved in on Saturday morning. Right So the motivation was finally, an external action cause necessitated the owner taking action. Right So then you're saying point is OK, we'll have that test done by forfeiting Friday right. That's the process of selling is uncovering the paint motivator. So we remember people move away from paint. They do not move towards pleasure. The other dynamic is what I always talk about is time cost, quality. Right he built in every scene. And I always talk about it because this is the other thing that you must always bear in mind when selling. So principle two time cost, quality. So that stands for lowest time with shortest time get the job done. Lowest cost and highest quality. And the old adage is you can have any two. But never all 3. Now, the reality is we must always deliver a solution that is in the sweet spot of all three. So your job is when your selling is to uncover all of those three actually goods. What are you dealing with. So it's not calling you what to do with the hot water someone does right. What's most important to them. Like if they're in a low socio economic neighborhood. They really will have like really could have lowest cost is the only motivator. Right but they could be fixed on time. So they're willing to try to pay a bit more hot water for two or three days when you get there. Or there could be quality. They've got five kids in the house and they're always running out of hot water and they just always want to have good shower places and lots of hot water. So they're up to quality, not lowest cost. Right So by understanding the situation, understanding the time cost, quality, and truly uncovering where they sit let's say you make sure that the offer you present will actually work for them. So they'll accept it. Right So unsteady pain critical. And then understand it's one cost, quality. What is it that they want to pay for right. What value. Right So those are the dynamics that are always in play that you must always uncover first. The third concept is people buy off people they trust and like that's a given. I said, I'm not talking about going to talk about the theory we're talking about you're going to do. You try to take thousands of dollars off these people or you've got ongoing work for them for release agents right. So if it's a one off transaction, then the relationship isn't less important. But if it's ongoing people buy off people they like or trust the three things you have to start establishing is what is the pain. What is the value that they're actually after and three is people or if people they like say trust. Right So those are three big dynamics in play. And so luckily it's a very simple price to go through that will bring all those things together in a very, very simple conversation. Makes it actually easy to sell right. Because once you uncover those three things selling becomes very, very, very, very simple. Now So this is how this is the approach is this is all sell theory sales pitches they're all signing up different models than the market. They all come to the same thing. I like this one because I can remember it. I can. It's called the baseball dawn and meet it right. It's full basis. I can see it in my head. So I can always. I can always remember it. And so I had to hit a homerun. So this was how it was sold to me. And I've always remembered it. So commit this to me me to be sincere. This is the prices and never deviate from this prices. And OK. So these four steps are hitting a homerun is four steps to making a sale. The first buys this relationship. So establish establishing a relation where they like you. The second base is understanding the problem. The third step is providing your solution. The fourth step is in getting agreement. Now in relationship to the first ice concept forces quickly relationship problem solution agreement. OK, so the first part is first base is relationship. So in the sales processivity about 75% of the time should be built spending time on building a relationship right Because people buy people they like. So how do you establish a relationship. So it's not about trying to sit on their back and say you're amazing. And your roles. And it's not relationship. So relation but just being interested. So the single biggest one of the single biggest pet peeves I have with most people is they don't understand what it's like to actually greet someone so a greeting is nice to see you. Thanks for the call. Nice to meet you. Nice to hear from you. Thanks for the invite. Because it's actually saying it's actually a compliment when you say, hey, how are y'all. It's actually a dominating statement that someone's forced to respond to. So if I say, hey mate. How are you. I actually made a statement and you actually forced to. You're forced to respond and generally I'm forcing you to kind of lie you know what I mean. Great guy you know what. Well, if has been a really tough morning or a tough few weeks until how I knew straight away. You're forced to go. Good night. Feel good. So there was no genuine exchange of feelings or emotions by saying how I am whereas when I. Nice to see you. Good to hear from you again. Thanks for the invite. That's actually a genuine greeting compliment with the piercing is like, oh, you're welcome. Thanks nice to meet you. So straight away the first foundation for a relationship is actually having a proper greeting that is not based on a domineering positive statement that's forcing is forcing a forced reply that's not honest. So physical stop saying how aya it takes practice to get over that. Because once you know what you got it's totally natural When you say have I nice to see you. So I got the wrong, didn't I. No quick question is. Nice to meet you. Nice to see you. So in that relationship. And then try and drop a compliment and saying, oh, this is a nice place you have here helping me being here. It's good school zones you've got nice gardens. Try and find something nice to say about them or the situation. What's going on, right. So it's just it's just building that right. Actually, you hear to listen. You recognize them and you engaging with them right. So spending time. And then if you're reasonably good with people you should get that seeds of oh Yeah. We've got a better relationships to sort of move forward. Right you've might even want to talk about the sport or the weather for a few minutes. I mean, don't belabor the point and be like a try hard, but do try spend a few minutes trying to build some connection where you feel the customer has warmed up to you. Right if you've got that cold cold shoulder from the customer and they're just as interested. I'm quite good at saying it's going OK. You know I don't feel like we're sort of getting on. Have I ever asked the wrong question or what's going on for me this morning. I'm just trying to work out with things need debated to give you the right solution to it. Kenny what's going on and is he being sort of quite straight up or down with Iraq until like I not ask what kind of kids you got. OK, great. And then the first thing you want to start working towards is uncovering the pain. Right why do they call you. And so you got Yep. So we're here to talk about what you just tell me through what looks like you get a funny. Give me a call. You know what some. What was the motivation to finally upgrade the bathroom or upgrade the kitchen or upgrade the Super Bowl. What's going on, right. If your job is to deliver the solution that they're after right then it went once I see the problem right. Why did they call you. Right because they will move away from pain. They don't move towards pleasure. Right So you. So now we're moving into what uncovering the problem. So uncovering the problem is actually means uncovering the pain motivator so this sets the bathroom innovation. And you go in like a year that was my mother was saying she's in a wheelchair or my or it's leaking through the floor below or let's go out and tell him. We hate it. Why do they hate it. It's still functional. What is it. They hate about it. What are they trying to get from the bathroom. Because what you see they're saying, oh, well, we want to really flesh bathroom we saw one on TV. We love a walk in shower. Where have I gone. Right So what you're trying to do is uncover the pain that they're actually trying to solve. Now this. This is very important that you truly understand that pain point. Right pain is the great motivator and then you feed it back to them. So then it's very important you go. OK, thanks for inviting me. So listen to what you got. Got it right. So you really need to. You really would like to do a new bathroom innovation because you used your in-laws are in a wheelchair. Your dad's had a stroke and it's really important that you've got a wide access to a way to the bathroom in a day when she shall says care. I can care for him. Have I got that right. And you to feed it back and say, hey, I got that right because the critical part if we can move on to the solution is that they go yet. You got no as soon as a customer sees you've got it. The silence by fuels. If it's the customer sees you. You got it. And you don't win the sell well you've really stepped up like it's almost impossible to sell what's the customers yet. Yes you've got it because that is one of the most fundamental things as a human being that absolutely just builds that deep trust that someone to feel heard and understood and listened to. It's a very rare commodity because English is often referred to it as a machine language is a command language and some it's not a romantic language. It's not good at giving feedback. It's do this, do that. This is the said, if we get to be very deliberate in at feeding back the conversation to the person. So that you can confirm with them have I got it. And then you want. Yes you've got it. So far in the process. I haven't even started telling them my solution. So I'm going to have my introduction not given us grading. Make sure there's some shared connection with it, we're like and now at least I well e they know that we're actually. All right to deal with friendly, reliable good. I've actually answered the problem and I've actually feed it back to them. Right states. So on this on the solution. Now before you start giving you a solution. This is where I've been asking. So in order to deliver this liquidity shower for your father what's more important for you. Now you said, you know this the three factors in construction that are undeniable right. We've got time cost, quality. And you need to get you to help me with group these constraints. And so these are the normal constraints we work in right. Shortest time lowest cost high value in it. And there's always a trade. So we're best on the what. What do you want to try it off. What's most important to you. Because, for example, if your father is in the hospital and needs to be out in two weeks time time for him is the most critical elements right. Critical so you go. OK What time is the critical element here. It just means cost is going to go up. Right So you just have to keep people in on charge and get the build a plan out of the toilet the painter electrician. I can make it happen. No problem for you. It is just going to cost more. But if you need it done on time, which you do. Are you OK with that. They're going to get you. But how much you get. OK, well, let's work it out together and see where you set. But straight away. Now you're working together on the solution. And that is the critical part of what you want is you want to be open around on this time cause quality arrangement and working with the customer to come up with the solution together because that's how you sell right is when the customer is involved in the prices. And I've agreed with the methodology and what you're going to trial. That's how you get the customer to agree on your price. So it's the same with the same with any selling is the roof. It's the drainage the drop what are you doing on the solution you talk about the time cost, quality trade and you take them through the prices and the trade that they're willing to make because the issue is if you just send them a quote in the mail or buy whatever it is by email it's got that one figure 24 grand. And they got another 15 grand 20 grand they've got it. They're not experts they've got no idea the difference between the tenders and the retaining walls and the style and steel pipes versus the price I've got no idea that I got a lot of retaining so I wanted that your job when you're doing the solution is by steeping in through those trade. They need the knowledge to be an informed decision. And they get to choose your methodology that they've chosen because I've understood the cost time quality implication right. And so you get. OK, well, I'm going to send you a quote based on using these steel posts rather than to the place because we don't want to make or I'm going to send you a quote on just fine rather than Tulsa that will keep the cost down. Right got you. Got it right. So then when you get to agreement you should be spending like the 0% time an agreement from your price. Because on the solution you've agreed on the agreed solution that you are going to deliver. And then you put that in writing in the agreement should almost be instantaneous. So you should be spending 75% of your time on the relationship and about 15% of your time on the problem because of problems. No, we don't like that. Well about 10% on the solution in therapy is not an agreement right. But if you step if you stick that he will through that process relationship trust you. You seem nice knowledgeable guy you've understood problem. They feed it back to them, you propose a solution on time cause quality that might also help to understand it and deliver it with you. And then you've just asked for agreement to get them a price based on the parameters. Now If you can't win it quite by doing that, then I'll eat my hat because that is just how it works. It's a tried and trude crisis. Selling is much more complicated than that. If you follow the prices follow that way. And the good thing is what it also does is it is truly only concerned about delivering customer outcomes that they've agreed to. That's exactly what they've agreed to. You're delivering exactly what they want dispense informed consent statement through their choices. Right you see that's right. You've written down on a quote and given to them. Good thing. It also does is it now sits it up. Clear expectations for the price be able to deliver the quite as per the expectations that you've written or down right. So that is display. And if you do selling like this, you'll win back with quotes course will we sort of go around sort of 36. The numbers see now you go hang on. It making sense. If we follow that prices. Why am I getting 100% Now, reason for that is you don't want to win 100% of your work. If you win 100% of your work. That means you were too cheap. So a 50% to 60% win rate is great. You're getting it just right. So if you're winning nothing then you're obviously too expensive. And if you're winning everything you need to be cheap. So 50 60% is about is about what you want to set and these signs of cleavage. You might want to try and just when you work in it. If you do that, then just have your prices shot now. It's never going to be one to face two sides simply go. Now it's quoting to win the work. Right So the fist that was talking about the theory right. Syria of selling the sick of it. This is actually near when you've actually got the quotes. What's not how to sell the quote, It's the customer experience to get you when rates are 60% to 70% And I think this is the thing that literally has always stood to the slight blows my mind. With traders is the promptness with which they respond to a request for a quote. So you think of all the effort that has been required for a customer to get in contact with you. A lot of it is word of mouth right. So a customer is talk to a friend of yours. Sorry client Ulysses recommends you or they've gone searching on the website that found you a number and then they've never called you right. And then you don't call the bank or answer your phone. I don't understand it. You've seen a lot of money on Edwards or a website to get these customers to call you and I get it. We're all busy and there's a lot going on. It's like AI later. But like now if a customer has said they wanted work, then you have to quit immediately had. How do you put yours. How do you put yourself in a position to actually do quiting. Give me day. And so this is what I did after getting it wrong for many, many years. It was so simple when we did it. So mean, I didn't have a big teams head. So I did it did have 20 25 staff. So I could have applied for a full time to inquire. But this is the prices to make sure quiting happened every day. And you'll need to do something similar, but adapted to your business. So we finally worked out. We would seen the fighting go around to the jobs every morning. So every morning is fierce site visits between 7:00 and the day where to look at jobs that were existing and to look at new customers who wanted work done. So he would generally go to those customers properties between 7 and 9 o'clock in the morning for his job. So those customers could get quite done. And then they could get off to work. And then Joe would go to the job sites look up the trays of the customers and buy from midday to 4 o'clock every day, he was scared to be in the office without fail like they hate to be a pretty serious reason why he wasn't meant to be in the office from 12 to 4 PM every day. And so his job with him was to do the quotes from the previous night or that morning and bang them out to the customer and get them done every day. We had another process for following up the quick fix because that wasn't his skill set. But getting the credit every day or the next night the worst case scenario is it is the plane. So in this time of coveted that is the sales price is different from the quoting prices. So if you want to win your quotes you must do your quotes promptly preferably if you can just get the customer to walk around the phone and do the quote their name when they're on the phone. Great But if have to go to site for whatever reason. Great But try and do that in quotes that evening or the next morning. So whatever prices you do you need to put time in your calendar aside. So you might quit every morning from 7:00 to 8:00 in the morning or 9 to 10 or whenever it is three times a week block that time off. We go. Yep This is my reason why quiting is until the customers go. Yeah, I did quiting on Tuesdays and Thursdays between 9 and 11. All right on Saturday. My site visits whatever it is. But stick to those things. So the customer knows Copeland is coming Thursday. I'll get my quite by Friday whatever it is. I have a prices that works. And then stick to it. So the second bit of quoting is then following up the quite so you still spend the time to get to sites. Spend the time to build the quote. You've seen it. Now you have to absolutely follow up within 12 hours that the customer actually got it. And so I found it very helpful here to have someone else calling not me. And spite of all the delivery prices when they get the emails you tell the customer. I am concerned about email. But I'm going to get an open space. And so just call you to make sure you've got it right. Now, the reason you're doing it is twofold. The first reason is to make sure they got it. It's amazing how many things disappear. The second one is you taking the pressure off the hard sell because often customers don't like the hard sell approach. So if you call them like going to give me the hard sell on them on the price to from me when it by having another person call them just to check. The person who gets a say on how. How was the price. How's it looking. Do we need to adjust it. Do we need to get Dan to give you a call. And it's amazing how often the customer is prepared to volunteer information to a third person because it isn't a pressure with that person. And if they go, oh, he is not quite right. It's a little bit high. Well can I get it. Can I get Dan to give you a call. Yeah OK, fine. And then she gets on the blower to me. And then I'll call them in and work out where it fell down because it's pretty rare it should fall down. We it into the prices. But it's always possible. But if you don't follow you're never going to know right. So I want you so you must follow up the follow up the price with the phone call, not an email or takes a phone call. Make sure I've got it handled any objections and then try and close the sale. Right since you close the sale it is very important to send over a deposit invoice. It's not a huge believer in getting deposit invoices because it locks in the sale and then order the materials in where way you go. So that's the sales to win quite sort of prices. Now selling to get new business. So this is also we'll start with choose the work you want to get because it really determines the approach you're going to take. So for example, in the 2008 2011 recession. We had to pivot my business entirely. So prior to 2008 I was basically just a renovation planner. I love doing renovations and good quality homes in the bigger jobs is great. You stick the guys on it for days and days you know you're not the general public. So that's what I'd love to do about that. He has a nice that work will destroy it up and wait to pivot very, very quickly. Into maintenance. This is a big lesson for all of those when this recession comes fishing new Zealand's all that good quality renovation work and new highway routines tends to dry up. But maintenance always, always stays. But the maintenance you need that's available is often not the good maintenance. It's like internal gutters roof leaks leaking skylights down pipes all the rats and mice stuff that you don't really want to do. You just have to do it. So shows the spark is working in hot ceilings. And they just have to do it. So they're working the work he's going after that very important that really determines the approach. So what I mean by that was we invested heavily in a website because we're going after maintenance work right. So because of going after maintenance work from new customers. I did employ dedicated people who knew how to build me a website professional photographer to take the good photos. And inappropriate content tell he could write the content and then a search engine optimization patient to do the good way, which properly. Right So it's a proper investment to do, which site, you need to do a website properly is going to cost you a 16 k probably. You can do your own kind when it works 15 bucks but it's not going to work as well as a website that's been properly crafted. I also want to talk to real estate work. But a website was no good for real estate agents and I'm going to Google websites looking for planners in Oakland. So what I did was I employed what's called a call center or an appointment. Now you can Google those are everywhere. And what they will do is they will call real estate agents when you like and organising a meeting for you. So we find a local company who had good people for the appointment sitting and then I had the marketing people put Jesus up like a little full page. I think that's sort of little folders you can buy is good quality cardboard folders just a very, very simple folder on what while papers your local plummet loyalty, what we were in who we were and what we were good at. But my pitch to them was also this Patrick pitch was to be the third or fourth out that they would call when your other two plumbers couldn't make the work. Now, because we want to weigh the risks that companies are driven by lowest price right. That's the deal. But I've never been about lowest price, but we speak about good value and good service. But I was very I'm always very aware that the plumbers they used are often the sole traders or to go ice because that cheap. They're often busy. And so I was proved correct. I was pretty sure that you went to shop in our price a little bit. We couldn't charge top price to recite. You can say that's fine. But my pitch was we'll be the third or fourth plumber that you call when these guys can't make it. And I'm fine with it. Just you just use this as the when you guys are too busy or full time officer now what happened was we became the dominant plumbers because the risk agents guy actually these guys are great because they default on all the stuff to always answer the phone. Always was always respond to emails. So the service that we provided we became number one plumber because it was like, oh, thank god as you always answering your phone, you guys always turn up because you 15, 20 of us right. Right We always had to try to go into that with full time dedicated maintenance binders right. Just write system become number one. But you don't say you sailors no initiation as either flight white, but the approach was I meet the customer with they were asked at say to reach are the agents. I don't like cold calling it's not my game. John McCain do it, but I'm never going to enjoy that prices. But here's a trick for you. He's a really good tip. I did it on my. Coaching What's this the customer doesn't have to answer the phone like when you call someone on a grumpy with you and really shirky. Well, that's their issue. If they were grumpy and shirky they shouldn't have answered to define if they're grumpy that you called. They should answer the phone is not your problem. How they responded. And that really helped me to go. Actually you're right. All I have to say is I know. Thanks, man. Not interested. That's literally all someone has to say. So if they're grumpy that's actually the problem. Don't worry about it. Right whatever the point that the point I'm trying to drive home hopefully is if you wanted to get new work in new business, you have to approach the customers and the medium that they want to be interacted with. So let's say you want to get commercial maintenance right. So you can actually get a women seater and get a list of commercial real estate companies that they will call and start targeting and stop making points for you. And what's your offline going to be. Right So in you're a little and you a little peck that you leave them with. What's the offer. What do you like what you see this table. What's your pricing level. What is it that you offer. And that's one of the things we offered for as a company is was this 24/7 service right side to come up with an offer with the team or what's it going to require for you guys to actually answer the phone right because the big thing is you never courses and the guys ignore it. So we did two things with that with this one is where the assistant could answer services. So when the phone call was missed it went to an actual answering service company. And I wish 24 7 right. So the phone call is always answered there. How can the industry snap if nothing else. Get an access service system where a person actually answers the phone because what they will do is send you a text message. This is really good. This was still used to stifle actual call that's done. So the trace message gets the call the key is to find the page out call a week and they get paid three hours pay. But that was our system, whatever. But this was the check and balance right. If they didn't answer the fine and went to answer services the services would then text the tradesperson and two managers may in the other operations manager right. Because you know niner authentic technicians that come in. OK What time of night. Some are texting me at 11:00 or 1 o'clock in the morning. I want to know why. And it's because it's a job. Now what it means is the tradesperson now knows that the boss and another manager is also checking the phone. So they have to comply. So they can't ignore phone calls and we would also you know we'll get a report on the phone calls. I received after hours and find them up and actually make sure that they did actually go and do the work. Well, once a coach is in place in the trade you realize, oh hey, we actually do the call outs. There's a process in place to make sure they happen. They kind of lose the jobs, then you know it all comes through and must rest agents stop funding and you actually do the call outs 24/7. You into becoming the default on this right. So that's how you get that work and you take the same methodology approach to whatever new business or work you're trying to get into whether it's commercial maintenance industrial maintenance. Where are those customers and how do you reach them. And generally speaking, the best approach the cheapest approach is actually an opportunity to call and book the meetings for you, but do you actually even offer that sexually attracted to those people in the office. Offer should generally consist as will be your second or third option if you and guys can't make it. And if your service is good enough, you'll very quickly be the number one right. So it's likely that approach like seeds right. OK upselling. Right So we hear it here. You hear a lot about upselling and shoot you big believer in upselling but there's a time and a place when you do that. Now you only do this once you've got agreement on the problem. And it's a great to the locked off. So let's take that shot. Let's take that shower example. You don't sell until you've got them locked away. That problem solved in a great turn moving on, right. So this is when you do the upselling nippy know your job and you guys gates gasping cries of all time traders which we all kind of are. You're right. I should be pretty good when you tune up to the job right. So as soon as you turn up to a jog. You'll write I should be like kicking into high into high gear. Right So I I'm a plumber, so I'm looking at down. Pop scouting suspects phones as bathrooms laundries hot water you name it. That's going to drain showers sinks. I try to make nothing possible. I write someone just watching taping taking it all the name of the game. Now was white. The patient. Keep it all here. Tick, tick, tick, tick, tick. And your background. Look, look, look, look. Let's say nothing. So first get agreement on the main job right cause pain is the motivator not pleasure. Right So first solve the pain point because if you think about it, when someone's in like sort of upset or angry with you and you try and solve their problems stomach now you just listen to me. Don't tell me that all this other stuff just listen to me. This is same thing here. The customer does want to hear, but we'll have to stop because I cause you to solve this problem. So big a year. OK What about the hot water. What about the spending the like. No, I'm trying to solve a problem with the shop. So first solve the problem with like hold you for getting great making it load off and you go. OK, cool. We got it now. You have your that. Yeah, I've also noticed as I was coming in that we've got these things gone on you'll never talk about just two things a maintenance will be here because, you know, the biggest part of any job that she's sort of getting trade in here and seeing is we're on site just to take care of these things. What have you noticed around the house. You think you want to upgrade you shall mix it, whatever. And that is when you start bringing the upselling but only after you've got initial agreement. Now Now I'm getting close. Getting through. It's good. We should start bringing your questions. We're coming to an end. What is the aim of everything we're doing right. So also what you to bear in mind. You often hear that the win-win right. You want a win-win for everyone in this code like right. When I buy food. I think more tangible will drive people to understand what that actually means. And I call it the repeat and refer. So I want to every customer to be a repeat customer and refer us to someone else because that's the source of wickets free is cheap. And all it requires is that you deliver an outcome to the customer. Run and I also like the saying is you can share a sheet. But you should never place a sheet right. So placing a chypre means you take the whole skin off. And there's nothing left. I never agree with that approach. You always want to leave a sweet taste in someone's mouth on a salad type right. So you always want to feel good about calling you. So they can tell their friends know what that looks like for me was I was always happy to get tino is now much cheaper than the top right. So it's always been middle of the pile for my right. I was never the lowest. But I was sitting near the most expensive plumbing company for my size. Now So maybe my margin because I charged you know that the right amount that I needed to make business money for my business, which was I was always trying to make a 40% or 50% gross margin on my jobs. But I was never trying to make a 60% or 70% gross margin. And I wasn't I've never been one to just try and maximize all the money. I can out of an owner because I want to repeat and refer and grow my business. And I can tell you that approach works right. So when I started my business at Citi just me one eye is like I 25 staff and we grew and grew and grew and grew and grew and grew it never stopped. Now that is done because I actually didn't rip people off. Yes I make money but I just need it. I just didn't charge through the tape. It was just always fair and reasonable because I wanted them to repeat and refer because you make more money on volume with 25 star than you do on maximum price with five people. You just can not Bateman sheer volume of turnover and slightly lower price right. If you're sort of repricing efficient you can do both. You can be a little bit cheap and still make very good money. So I'm always trying to deliver what's called what I call lowest value. So what the customer. It's the lowest value isn't lowest price right. But lowest value. So what you want from the customer is what value do they actually want to pay for. And how can I deliver that at the lowest cost to you. To make money for me right. This is actually a win-win right. Right when the customer agrees to pay your price and they're happy about it because that's actually how you build a really successful business. When you work in this hell they call you again and tell and tell their friends about you. It's because you. You worked out and delivered to them the lowest of value that they actually wanted to pay for right. And so that is a proper win-win. But I like to call it a paper first. So try to can understand this part of your values that you want to pass on to your staff. As you say. Want to make every customer repeat and referred. So it's really important that we get them a great job, and we rip them off. Right So in that I was hoping there would be more questions. So Lisa is a Q&A working or is it just them not working because normally there's more questions now, especially with many people online. So not sure of the q and I is not it not up all. No that she's saying. So now is the time to ask your question. Because I have left about sort of 10 minutes with so-called q an ace to ask your questions on antidepressants and selling. So please do put them in the check box. Otherwise, I'm going to be sitting here trying to tell bed digits. Actually do you want a bad day jack. Actually is a great one. So this is for you dads out there. Ask them. I say ask me if I got a haircut. I want to ask difficult to get this guy. Did you get a haircut you got. No, I got the mocha. Darren will I like I like it. OK Oh, I see. Good question. So this question is, how do you deal with customers when couples are disagreeing as if the wife wants it done, and the husband wants to do it himself. So OK. So I came back to the priciest relationship problem right. So first of all, always, always make sure you've established a cordial relationship with both peoples that both people like you the second one there was understand the pain motivators of both people. So once again, it's like, OK. So ask the why why do you want to get it done right. Because you've got the kids coming for the kid's birthday party. And that's the husband. And what's the hesitation at paying us to do it. Why would you let yourself go. So if he goes, I just want to save costs. I don't want to spend the money you go. OK What do you do about that. Because in all reality if you look at the cost the job is 50% materials right. So you've got all those materials anyway. Most jobs are going to take 3, 2 six hours right. You say let's say we're 100 bucks now. So it's going to cost you 40 bucks labor. We'll get it done by Friday. Do you really want be spending all day Saturday trying to do this yourself like there's a lot of like we've got a lot of tools or experience gear. So what I'm doing is emphasizing the pain that he's going to go through right because that's what you want to bring to someone's life as people avoid paying they don't move towards pleasure. So what you want to demonstrate when you're selling is when do you think the husband is like, do you want to be spending all day Saturday. To do that three trips for the merchant. You need these tools not to go wrong. Thank you. The that we want to do because like that's really what you want to do. Hoo Wait, what are they all that you can even campari this drill to help you out because like, I get it. But yeah, I don't I don't understand it like we could just get it done for you and be all done. What do you think. Right dial. How do you go negation. After the quote or is it the first price speech price. Satan said, OK, this is the nub of the run, so I was asked the exact wrong question because how do you go for negation negotiation after the quite right because this is the place that you don't want to be. So we're not talking about $100 job here. We're talking jobs with sales of the. Right So if you've followed the prices of relationship problem. A solution agreement you shouldn't be in this position right. But what you can know. This is what I love about it. If you follow the prices. This is what you can do. So rather than challenging the customer on the price you go. OK I thought we had alignment on the outcome. What we sort of ahead agreed to do the job. This way. And so I've priced according to this way this other price. You know the methodology they've agreed to. They come. They're using the same methodology. They done something different. What's own. Tell me what's changed for you. Because I can change my price to meet that price. But I'll have to just change the methodology for that price. And so you bring it back to the agreed outcome that you'd agreed upon. Right So rather than negotiating on the price because you don't want even if you like, between us you come back to the methodology of how you got to your price that you're happy to modify your price if you can modify the outcome. Right because that's what you want the discussion to be. You don't want to be arguing over $100 what you want to be shifting the customer to is the trade that they're going to be making for the price. Now, if there's no methodology and it's just a little similar. It's a like for like replacement and luxury just the customers just got the price. It is just cheaper than this is for you to make the decision you have to make. Do I wanted the job for just take the money and go and you buy it. You work like if you've got no work. Take the money and move on. If you've got lots of work. Don't take it look for something else. And so this is why I'm saying you'll win rights and you're going to be 50 60% because for all of its will in the world, even when you follow the price someone else has just made a mistake. Well, that just a lot cheaper and there's nothing you can do about that. And that's just life. So hopefully that answers the question. This is from no use analysis triggering. So this is going to read out Nelson knows also positive statements. You don't have to stretch supply out when you get an opportunity. Think of it like a year that they will pay you a dividend each year. I remind guys that customers pay their wages for even what your mother said on sales. I tell it guys they creating their own security when they when they find more work in a property. This will create such a customer and I couldn't I couldn't agree more with that. This is a question from Marcus. It's very customary in this real area area that everyone says How's it going. How do you suggest we rephrase it. When someone says it to you. You just go oh fine. Nice to see you again Marty. Nice to see. Nice to see you again Marcus. Nice to meet you, Marcus. It's not up to you to retrain the public. But your job is to just always deliver a statement. It's always nice to see you again Marcus. Good to talk to you. I could see you looking well. Always fun. I want to give a compliment as I see it. How do you deal with a race to the bottom scenario and not be the bottom. But still win jobs at a fair price. Like I said, it's two things here. Right the other question is, if these are the net. This really is the nitty gritty. That's the nub of it. Right So the right to the bottom scenario, not be the bottom. Right But still when we see a price. So let's break this down because this is that side 0.1 is you could be too expensive in these times because your overheads are just too expensive and your lifestyle is too expensive and you could just be too expensive because of your expectations especially especially you would gee your geographic location has a big impact on your work life. If you are in a small country or a small rural town or a small seaside town there's not many people in the good times are gone for a while. You will have to drop your prices and lower your expectations. And that's just fine. That's just the reality in recessions right. You might want to say good times and you're just sort of surviving in the hard times and it's OK. Right So that's one point. So it is being realistic around looking at the territory you live in and going, well, that's where to respond. The second thing in play is supply and demand. And so this is outside forces that you have no control over. And this is scary. This is hot knock I to deny it. But it's also the reality that you're living in. If there is a surfeit of labor. So for example, at Bendigo ballarat somewhere in Australia, like the big industrial town with lots of big industrial clients lots of electricians doing lots of work. Like just thousands of stockings in small towns. Now if they gaze at a while the stock price goes out of business. And it is now, hundreds of spark is on the market. The price is going to go down. And that's just that's a capital market and action and you just have to deal with it just like in Perth when the mining collapses even as wages go down. And the only choices you have in those environments is moved to where there's more capital and more people and more options. So you move to bigger city or work for lease. That's the brutal reality right. The so those are two scenarios that are just really hard to deal with. And you can't ignore right to try to alleviate that and see that this is why there's often that saying pick a nation get rich right. So for example, I dealt with a guy the other day. His business is fish tanks. He's got like, oh my goodness. Like three or four guys. Full time and all I do is keep tropical fish tanks and people's fish tanks and fish gardens alive making a killing and their business will never go through this recession is going to grow because people love the fish he's going to grow. So no problem. There's a very nice specific way. So for example, in the last big recession. I spent 15 grand on late detection gear right. I invested to go extra nice of late detection gave that away for dirt cheap because I wanted to dig up the water mains. So in these difficult times you don't want to be competing for like all plumbers want to hot water somewhere. Mr. Sparky is want to upgrade a switchboard right. You don't want to be doing that work. You want a phone nations right. The other thing I got on to by accident was we saddling playground working would apply here. If we can really good at doing would apply all the plumbing tax and the waterfalls great. So to get out of those areas. See you. So one is look at the area run and be realistic go now evens after Wilson the lowest placement the job. That's fine, except that we'll move away or go into nation nation industries. That's those are the realities is there's number of ways you can't win the work. But if you're only going off at the price you won very rare. It's just capital. It's just capital injection market forces right. It's this fine. I've actually answered that question wealthiest if this is from David. Our interest rate is eligible and plumbing all seem to suffer from customers wanting quite small jobs. How do you recommend we identify and deal small jobs that don't warrant a site visit. Quite so. David Yes. Video video quoting is very good. Just asking the customer to walk around if it's a small job, then you don't need to look at much, right. And just then it's a quite I'm a huge believer that giving customer price expectations. It's really great. But I say these tiny jobs. I agree. Don't do site visits, because it's time expensive and consuming but you can't just do video recording. So the customer knows what they're up for. So I think that I think when you look at it. I don't know if customers always want a fixed price electron sample it when I get a Sparky to come in here. Put on a plumber. I really got no idea what it's going to cost to put the seed to light on outside but that's going to probably be underground. But more than 500. I want to take my kalanick in it. I've got no idea if going to be 400 or 1,200. I don't really I don't want a fixed price. I just want a price range is going to be one grand or two grand. And so I think we will see that quite often. Also, we need to do is remember the prices right relationship problem solution. So it's digging into the problem to actually lay off. Are they up lower his price. Will they just stopped and sort of sold their pie and just have a bit of a price range right. So once again, always up to uncover the pain that someone's after you might find they just want to know what to price go and not actually the lowest price. It brings us to 12 59 which is the one hour I think we might be done. So this is a last minute flurry of questions we might have done exactly the one hour, which sure on rather Christi but to be clear on one will from now on, you know and all customer calls and ask, can you come round and give me some advice. How much advice can you get for free. They will 15 minutes free in charge for a report. You know, I. This is one of those spin. No, I sit on the fence a lot here. I think a lot of it depends on the customer right. So if the customer is actually a pretty good person. And you can tell that he just really lost like you don't mind helping them out. But if they want those people you can just tell them. It's going to try and use you you get the lowest price in shop rents and sales and thousands of dollars. Then I charge for my full time. And so once again, I've been time uncovering the pain, the problem that trying to solve and will and will vary my price accordingly. And so I think reading all the questions. I think the biggest thing I can press upon all of you always uncover the pain. Why did the customer. Finally decide to give you a call. Because as soon as you uncover that the rest of it becomes quite straightforward and quite easy in how you respond. We'll all be very straightforward once you understand the pain of why they gave you a call. So answer your question. No if I need the money I'll take it. But you won't be dependent on the customer for like them or not. That was a two way street. I don't like giving advice for free. I right, guys. I think thanks Duncan. I think we may. Oh yes please answer the poll because we're. We're going to go to two weekly seven webinars from here on three singers. Back to work. But I also understand that midday is not as good a time anymore. Maybe So I just put some options here. 812 for six or maybe you to watch them on demand and we'll take you from there. Anything email the team that try to have all the videos. So we're still holding daily trying these Fergus do take that up to get the most out of the tool you're paying for. This is me obviously, this is the box $9 Amazon. It's $9 you ever read 12 chapters on how to change your business and change your life. Do you pick it up for $9 give it to your operations team to read. Really good. Can I email the team webinar at Fergus for topics or questions or advice. I am here to help Steve Thompson follow up what he means is as follows function to we got to figures had a follow up function all there is. You can. Yep So in figure CEOs follows you just see the reminder or the task with the checklist when you want it to remind you to. Yep So there are six all in me. And I think on that note ladies and gentlemen, we will stop the webinar actually see you in two weeks.